Selling Firearms at Auction

As President of the Minnesota State Auctioneers Association, I receive a myriad of questions on an assortment of topics. Some of the questions are fairly generic, and would apply to most auctioneers. For example, this week I received the following email:

I have always heard that we were legal to sell firearms if they are part of an estate or if the auction that we are working is a 1 party auction.

Our local sheriff called me and said that this is incorrect…any firearm that are sold at auction need to be sold under a FFL.

I called the St.Paul office of Tobacco, Firearms, etc. and visited with a gal named Mary. She again, told me that I was legal to sell as I mentioned above.

I also received a call from another auctioneer in our area – he had heard that the sheriff had visited with me…this auctioneer said that in Minnesota – you are legal to sell any firearm without running them thru an FFL. This auctioneer sells a lot of firearms..

When I answer a question for a member, I like to provide the sources I used for my research. I believe this empowers the member to learn. It also encourages them to share the information with others, as it’s just not well I talked to this person and they said it was okay. Much of this style comes from working at the law office where I cite every thing I write.

My answer to the question: Selling Firearms at Auction: Before I answer your questions, I’ll point you to the sources I used for to obtain the answers.

The ATF provides the Federal Firearms Regulations Reference Guide online. A copy can be found here: http://www.atf.gov/pub/fire-explo_pub/2005/p53004/index.htm

Within the guide, there is a section entitled “Rulings, Procedures, and Industry Circulars” within that section is ruling 96-2 Activities of auctioneers requiring a dealer’s license. This ruling discusses at length what an auctioneer can and can’t do without a license. I’ve attached a pdf of the rulings. Ruling 96-2 is found on page 15 and 16 of the pdf, and page 133 and 134 of the document. The text of the document is informative, and somewhat lengthy. However, it finds the following:

Held: Persons who conduct estate-type auctions at which the auctioneer assists the estate in selling the estate’s firearms, and the firearms are possessed and transferred by the estate, do not require a Federal firearms license.

Held further: Persons who regularly conduct consignment-type auctions, for example, held every 1-2 months, where the auctioneer takes possession of the firearms pursuant to a consignment contract giving the auctioneer the exclusive right and authority to sell the firearms at a location, time and date to be selected by the auctioneer and providing for a commission to be paid upon sale are required to obtain a license as a dealer in firearms pursuant to 18 U.S.C. § 923(a).

Hopefully this information helps. Your local sheriff appears to have provided you with incorrect information. There are instances when an auctioneer can sell firearms without a license or involving a licensee. I trust you’ll find this information helpful.

If you have any questions for me that you’d like me to answer, feel free to contact me in any of the ways on my connect page. I’m glad to offer my assistance.

In my last post, I talked about how investing in the stock market was a bad investment when viewed in the context of inflation. In the recent months, I’ve had opportunities to do some soul searching – real deep soul searching – about investing, and life.

Last year, I was invited by a friend and mentor to attend a charity golf tournament, dinner and auction. The event was a fundraiser for Northern Voices – a center for young children with hearing loss that enables students to communicate through the use of spoken language, and helps families prepare their children to reach their full potential.

My expectations for the day were pretty minimal – play a round of golf, have a few drinks, enjoy the company of friends, and head home unaffected by the day. Well, three out of four isn’t bad – is it? You see, I was affected by the day – in a deep and disturbing way. It wasn’t the deep part that scared me. No sir, it was the disturbing part that I struggled with for almost six months.

I am a product of a family that prides itself on hard work. In fact, I’m active in our family business and work hard – often times excessively. I also work for several other companies on a freelance basis. As a result, my free time is limited, and my financial resources exceed my expenses – resulting in some disposable income that I somehow seem to squander on assorted non-necessities.

Rewind six months to the charity golf tournament. After the tournament, there is a silent auction, dinner and live auction. Having attended many similar events, I’m pretty used to the “sales pitch” and assorted other means of getting into my checkbook. In fact, as the auctioneer for several benefits and similar events, I’m also quite accustomed to making the pitch. As a result, it’s a bit more difficult to get me to support a specific cause. So, I’m sitting at dinner and the program begins, and several children get up and talk about how the support of the individuals in the room have made an impact on their lives – how literally because of the support and activities at the center, they’ve been given the gift of hearing. I’m sure you can already guess how that played out with me. I was pretty much tearing up, and grabbing my checkbook at the same time.

For nearly six months, I reflected internally on that moment. Not so much about the cause but about the real impact it had on these children. The more I reflected the more disturbed I became with society and more specifically myself. I struggled inwardly for months about how I was choosing to live my life, and spend the resources entrusted to me.

About a month ago it came to me. When or how, I’m not sure. It just came to me. I realized that we as a society, and me specifically, work our butts off to make a dollar so that we can save a few cents of it to put on a pile for retirement (you already know my thoughts on the primary pile we’re encouraged to use), or worse haphazardly squander it away. That’s when it hit me. If each of us took the 10% we’re encouraged to save, and actually invested the funds into people that need the assistance, where would be as a society? I know, you already give at work to the United Way or Salvation Army, or give at church. I’m not talking about that kind of giving. I’m talking about giving directly to those in need – skip the red tape, the bureaucracy, the middle man – give it direct to those in need.

Armed with that information, I’ve been talking to friends and family about my realization – if we all stopped investing in trying to increase our pile and started investing in the lives of those in need, how much better off would society be? The good news is they all agree we’d be much better off. The bad news is I think it’s mostly lip service. In fact, several people said that’s great, I’ll take the extra from your pile. Argh, that’s not the point, and that’s not the intended recipient.

I’ve resolved that I’m going to make a difference going forward. I can’t always do 10%, and sometimes I can’t do anything. But I can avail myself to do something when I can afford to do it! And, forget about me giving funds to a large corporate charitable group. I want to see my efforts making a difference to the fullest extent possible. I’ll be supporting smaller organizations, families I know could use an extra $100 here and there, or individuals that could use a hand with a project or some food. It’s certainly the least I can do, and the payoff so much richer than a financial investment gone good. What are you doing?

The sale of motor vehicles in the State of Minnesota is regulated by Minnesota Statutes § 168.27 and Chapter 7400 of the Minnesota Administrative Rules.  The statute is clear on the requirements of an auctioneer concerning the sale of motor vehicles. Minnesota Statute § 168.27 indicates in part:

Subdivision 1a. (b): No person shall engage in the business of selling used motor vehicles or shall offer to sell, solicit, deliver, or advertise the sale of used motor vehicles without first acquiring a used motor vehicle dealer license.

This is very clear, and takes all auctioneers (and all persons) out of the business of selling used motor vehicles.  There are exceptions that allow the sale of motor vehicles without licensure that come later in the statute.

Subdivision 1a. (h): No person shall engage in the business of auctioning motor vehicles for more than one owner at an auction or shall offer to sell, solicit or advertise the sale of motor vehicles without first acquiring a motor vehicle auctioneer license.

This is very clear that no auctioneer can sell, solicit or advertise the sale of motor vehicles for more than one owner at auction.

Subdivision 5a: No person may solicit, accept, offer for sale, or sell motor vehicles for consignment sale unless licensed as a new or used motor vehicle dealer, a motor vehicle wholesaler, or motor vehicle auctioneer.  This requirement does not apply to a licensed auctioneer selling motor vehicles at an auction if, in the ordinary course of the auctioneer’s business, the sale of motor vehicles is incidental to the sale of other real or personal property.  Incidental means up to a total of ten but no more than ten percent of the items in the posted auction bill are motor vehicles.

In this subdivision lies the loophole. This statute exempts an auctioneer from Subd. 1a.(h) (which states an auctioneer shall not sell, solicit or advertise the sale of motor vehicles for more than one owner at auction) provided no more than ten percent of the items on the auction are motor vehicles.

While the letter of the law indicates by selling ten times the number of smaller items as compared to the motor vehicles, an auctioneer is exempt from motor vehicle licensure.  I believe the spirit of the law would preclude an auctioneer from doing so.  In addition, many auctioneers (many of whom are auto dealers and many who are not) have commonly held that you may not sell for more than one seller at any given time.  This statute seems to go against that belief.  That said, I am familiar with enforcement actions against auctioneers for selling for more than one seller, and for selling more than ten vehicles at a large one-owner auction.

It is quite easy to take the exception from this subdivision at its surface value.  However, when reviewed in the entire scope of the statute, I believe the court would hold that an auctioneer conducting a large consignment auction with 50 vehicles, and 500 other lots, would be subject to licensure, as the spirit of the law in several places appears to preclude an auctioneer from doing so.  However, as you notice, the letter of the law can be read quite different.  Furthermore, my understanding is the State of Minnesota dealer licensure division is interpreting the exception to the letter of the law saying you may sell a number of motor vehicles up to ten percent of the total items on the auction bill, rather than to the spirit of the law.

Subdivision 8. (b) in part: Isolated or occasional sales or leases of new or used motor vehicles are exempt from this section…. “Isolated or occasional sales or leases” means: … (3) sales by a licensed auctioneer selling motor vehicles at an auction if, in the ordinary course of the auctioneer’s business, the sale of motor vehicles is incidental to the sale of other real or personal property.

Again, the exemption granted in Subd. 5a. is stated.  Previously the definition of incidental was given – up to a total of ten but no more than ten percent of the items in the posted auction bill being motor vehicles.

However, I again argue, the spirit of the law should be considered.  While one may argue that the letter of the law allows 50 vehicles from 50 different sellers so long as there are 500 other non-motor vehicle items to be sold and listed on the auction bill, I do not believe the intent of the law was for such an event to occur.

I have also reviewed the applicable Minnesota Administrative Rules and there does not seem to be any further clarification.  A call to motor vehicle licensure department confirmed that the letter of the law is being enforced in many instances, rather than the spirit of the law.

While this loophole exists, and I believe it needs to be closed, I have mixed feelings on the matter.

I.    If the motor vehicle licensure department is indicating the auctioneer seeking consignments, and selling motor vehicles is acting within the letter of the law so long as no more than ten percent of the items are motor vehicles, should we as an association be pushing for closure of the loophole?

II.    I believe the auctioneer is not acting in good faith, or within the spirit of the law. When reading the statute, it seems clear the intention was to disallow auctioneers from conducting regular consignment auctions of vehicles without being subject to the dealer license laws.  This makes sense to me on several levels including matters of liability, bonding, sales and transfer taxes, and insurance.

III.    I do not believe the board or executive committee can act without the direction of a majority of the membership. To lobby for a law change when the state is accepting of the position is not, in my opinion, within the board’s power. That said, if legislation were proposed or the membership desired the loophole closure, the association would need to take a position on the topic, and could then begin the necessary lobby efforts.  This is a reactive approach and quite the opposite of how I would like to proceed. I would much prefer to head off any troubles prior to them beginning.  However, it is best either to wait for legislation from outside the structure of the association, and to respond at that time, or to pursue closure of the loophole at the direction of the membership.

IV.    I am aware of many auctioneers in the State of Minnesota who also hold their motor vehicle dealer license.  They are acting in good faith, and should not be subject to competition from others who are not acting in good faith and are circumnavigating the intent of the statute.

V.    I believe revision of the definition of incidental from “Incidental means up to a total of ten but no more than ten percent of the items in the posted auction bill are motor vehicles” to “Incidental means up to a total of ten motor vehicles” would sufficiently remove the loophole.